Gary Shaw and Doug DeLuca Resign From ProElite
EliteXC president Gary Shaw and ProElite chief strategy officer and executive chairman Doug DeLuca have resigned from their positions with the MMA promotion according to ProElite’s latest SEC filing.
DeLuca also previously served as ProElite’s chief executive officer.
Shaw, DeLuca, Kurt Brendlinger, and David Marshall also resigned from the ProElite board of directors. Edward C. Hannah, Edward Corey, and Robert E. Brierley have been added to the board of directors and ProElite CEO, Charles Champion, has been elected chairman of the board.
The resignations were accepted on July 23rd, just days before the promotion’s second nationally televised event on CBS which, while generally considered a better event than their May 31st debut, returned poor ratings that dropped more than 40% over their first CBS event primarily due to a lack of starpower on the card.
DeLuca and Shaw have agreed through their respective companies to provide consulting services to ProElite through September 30th, 2009.
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SOMEONE GOT SCARED
anyone think the ufc will pick back up lawler and diaz once elite xc goes under…what about kimbo haha dana said he would get murdered in the ufc..which is probably about right…
Well Cole you raise an interesting point! Diaz was pretty much dropped by the major organizations due to his marijuana habit but still has the talent. As for Lawler I don’t know if Lawler would want to have to start back at the bottom of that mountain again. As for Kimbo who knows what is next for him, if he went to Affliction I would laugh hysterically though.
I can’t judge the last EliteXC event because I was to busy watching the Cotto/Margaritto fight, (which was the best boxing match I have ever seen by the way) but the way it sounds is these guys were released the day before it even aired. Sounds like they already knew ahead of time that the ratings would drop drastically. I hope this improves the EliteXCrap so that the UFC continues to give us more free events due to competition.
I feel sorry for these other organizations. Dana is so quick to fire people but dont want other companyies up. What about people that Dana so call cant stand, where are they to go? Ufc is becoming the WWE of MMA
As an MMA fan I want the UFC to only gain more talent. If someone has a problem working for Dana/UFC, they should change their attitude. I do think Dana can be arogant and egotistical but I am far from getting mad at the guy. He is one of my heroes. None of us would be on this site discussing MMA if not for Dana helping MMA rise up to the main stream. I’d have an ego to if I turned the UFC into a billion dollar company when it was next to non existant. Gary Shaw can eat his f-n words now for all the garbage he spewed Dana/UFCs way. I read on another site that Shaw’s health and family have taken a toll over his ventures in MMA…..LOLOLOLOLOLOL……Shaw’s fat ass is f-n pathetic. Boxing promoting crooked POS!
My favorite part of all of this is the fact that Gary Shaw talked a ton of **** about Dana and said Dana had an ego.(true but ****talking none the less)
Dana’s reply: “How’s this for ego? Let’s see where Gary Shaw and Elite are in 5 years.”
HA!!!!! Dana was right. Maybe he does have a clue to what he is doing…..
IM WITH YOU KOUCH. DANA IS THE MAN. IVE ALWAYS HAD RESPECT FOR HIM. WHAT HE HAS DONE FOR THIS SPORT HAS BEEN INCREDIBLE. AND I DON’T UNDERSTAND WHY THESE PEOPLE SAY UFC IS THE WWE OF MMA. THATS BS. PEOPLE ARE HATING. I HOPE DANA SIGNS KIMBO ON A ONE FIGHT CONTRACT JUST SO HE CAN GET HIS A$$ BEAT. SO HE’LL SHUT UP..
Cole,
Maybe the UFC can pick up Kimbo and Guyborg then have them meet weight somewhere in the middle. Guyborg by KO rd1.
Really I think Lawler could come back to the UFC and be a force…..not a champ though. He looks better when he takes his time and counters oppose to attacking like a rabid crackhead. As for Diaz??? I think I’ve defended the guy enough to prove I am a fan of his but he doesn’t belong in the UFC. His ground game is superior to many but after watching his lack of punching power, I’d worry about him trying to stand with a majority of UFC fighters. Looks like Shields may soon be on his way to the UFC. I can only hope.
YZFox,
I understand people not liking Dana’s personality but like I said, if any of us here turned any business from next to non-existant to a billion dollar company, we would be feeling pretty high and mighty as well. I bet Affliction will pick up Kimbo….he’s a BIG NAME.
HAHAHAHA it’s laughable to think the EliteXC is going under because of this news.
This only makes them BETTER in my opinion.
Any of you thinking they actually “resigned” has your head in the sand. They were KICKED THE F OUT.
In the even of a merger All title holders are hot property. Kimbo is the hottest name and if he has value left he is going to get every possible match he can and a TUF coaching gig too. Nick and Shields will be bankable. Nick especially because of Nate.
Gary Shaw should due jail time…Fraud
Just remember guys… Dana White doing his little song and dance to try and eliminate the competition will eventually be viewed as immature and bad for the sport.
What are you guys going to do then?
Me? I’ll still be watching all MMA shows no matter who does them.
Dietirich,
Just assuming Kimbo ends up in Affliction eventualy….what do you think they will pay him? I’m going with $750,000-$1million. SICKENING!
Dannyboy,
I like how Dana and the UFC go about business. I want the majority of talent in one promotion. Other promotions a great to provide more MMA but with the UFC taking a different route than the world of boxing, I like the UFC controlling the masses of talent. That way I get to watch better match ups.
Dannyboy how does this make them better? They lost out to a re-run of a UFC ppv event on cable….It kinda sounds like to me…without Kimbo…elite xc is gunna bomb..I do give them props tho for making it a better show than the first
KOuch,
The sad part is he may get 10cents on the dollar. I have a feeling Reality Kings gets the majority of what he makes. He’s MMA’s Leon Spinks….
DANNYBOY IS DISSING US ALL BECAUSE WE ALL KNOW THAT UFC IS THE TOP PLACE AND ELITEXC AND AFFLICTION IN MY OPIONION ARE GONNA GO NO WERE. HES SAYING WERE NUTHUGGERS. PLEASE EVERY COMMENT YOU ARE HUGGING THOSE ORGANIZATION. DUDE GET OVER IT…. ELITEX SUCKS WITH OUT KIMBO LIKE COLE SAID. AND SAME WITH AFFLICTION AND FEDOR.
Gotta pull for the UFC over Affliction and XC. Both are like Bodog and Iron ring. You just want to was the filth off after viewing…Alexs should never been on the card…Thompson should have had his ear drained….
KOuch, if Dana was a better person I wouldn’t mind it. He’s not. He’s a self rightous little wannabe that when wielding the absolute power you’re talking about will be VERY bad for MMA.
Cole, I expected them to lose… a lot of people don’t buy PPVs and they got one they may not have seen for free. The bottom line is that you and I both watched EliteXC. We know MMA and watched it…most that watched Spike either didn’t know about it or hadn’t seen the PPV cause they cost too much (another thing that will change with 1 to 2 more promotions doing well).
YZF, I am happy to take the WAMMA nuthugger of the year award home and rest it on my mantle. However, to simply dismiss the competition as “sucks, boring, stupid” is retarted in it’s on right. Oops did I just call you retarded? Yes I did…stop with the damn CAPS.
What’s with the Kimbo to Affliction talk? I’m sure Affliction would love the hype for their event. However, it’s doubtful that Kimbo’s managers would let their moneyticket go to an organization where he would be the worst HW. Seriously, he has to know that he would lose to every one of those guys. Hell, he would lose to the LHW’s and MW’s in that org.
Dietrich, Thompson did have his ear drained. It just swole back up before the fight.
Danny/Hippy Terroist,
Dana has been nothing but good for MMA. He basically introduced to the USA. Until he makes a move that impacts MMA as a whole in a bad way, cannot think any different.
RLT,
Kimbo would lose to Guyborg…..that’s still in his home promotion…Elite.
are you sure Dannyboy…thats gotta be the worst case of cauliflower ear I’ve ever seen
guyborg has to have a set a balls..that thing has more testosterone than most men…
KOuch maybe one day you will see the light about Dana. 120+ fighters can’t all be liars.
Im glad Dannyboy has tooken on the role of the Martin Luther Kings Jr of MMA….”I have a dream that all MMA fighters will not be judged by Dana White, but by the content of their character”
HA HA HA HA POOR GUY.
“HILARIOUS”
WOW, FIRST I’M A HIPPIE TERRORIST AND NOW I’M MARTIN LUTHER KING?? THAT’S JUST CRAZY! I’VE GONE FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER I SUPPOSE. THAT WOULD MAKE ME SOME LIBERAL FLIP FLOPPER RIGHT?
PERSONALLY I JUST LOVE THE USE OF THE WORD ‘TOOKEN’. ONE OF THE GREAT NON WORDS OF OUR TIME BEING USED PERFECTLY IN A SENTENCE. KUDOS!
MY GOD TYPING IN ALL CAPS HAS TO BE ONE OF THE HARDEST THINGS I’VE DONE IN A LONG TIME. YZF YOU EVEN FIND THE TIME TO HIT THE SHIFT KEY TO PUT YOUR “QUOTES”. AMAZING!
Cole,
That was great….I have a dream…..HA!
Dietrich,
Good site.
there’s more drama on this board than a one hour episode of jerry springer…
With these 2 out, it is only a matter of time before elite xc gets bought out. Facts are facts and Kimbo Slice is a ratings powerhouse. It would be a great move if Affliction stepped in and purchased elite xc. There aren’t many top draw stars to buy, but affliction doesn’t need huge stars, they need a good supporting cast.
This is all great. The UFC will reign supreme like it should. First with PRIDE, then the IFL, then they will pick the best of ProElite, and then set their target on Affliction. I think there needs to be another quality organization just to keep the UFC on its toes and goint to new levels, but crap like what was witnessed on Saturday night needs to go. Pilage the town, take their women and children, and GO!
if dana picks up kimbo…then there is not chance at affliction even being a contender cause then ufc(already gets tons of views) + Kimbo(the reason elite xc got views)…it will be all over…..add in some new great fighters..shields,lawler,diaz,bigfoot silva…and maybe a new womans division(with carano) and you have an unstoppable force in mixed martial arts!
what do you guys think about guyborg? post op or pre op…
i like affliction but with the same fighters on every ppv its gonna get real boring and probably go under when trump drops it and atencio realizes that he really is at-shirt guy not an mma kind of guy…i guarentee that affliction 2 does no where near as good as affliction banned
dannyboy, it’s called caps lock. welcome to 4th grade typing.
kouch,
i’m with you about dana, i like the guy and i think he’s done enough for the sport to be a little cocky. i do have to disagree with you though on one thing which is he didn’t introduce it to the US. The gracies did along with the former UFC owner which Dana and the Fertida’s later jacked it from. Still, they did take it from the ashes and raise it to a level that it wouldn’t be without them.
I think my one real issue with Dana is that he seems a bit hypocritical. he acts like the god of MMA and when guys cross him he really makes it known that they’re done in the sport. but when guys step up and save his ass (i.e. ross pointon) and he talks about how those are real fighters, why haven’t I seen them since? maybe cuz they chose not to fight anymore, but my hunch is that it’s cuz they got used by dana and they were done serving their purpose.
Wow you guys really need to head over to dictionary.com and look up the word ’sarcasm.’ Surely you don’t think I held the shift key down when I typed. LMAO.
Wow, who wants to see girls in the UFC? That is dumb and crazy. Too much talent to waste time on that. Plus new fighters? Lawler, Diaz, Smith have all been in the UFC. I wouldnt mind seeing Bigfoot Silva in the heavyweight division, that division could use some new blood. But don’t bring the girls, that is just a bad move.
soooo…would they bring guyborg over…Im not sure what category we would put that thing into…
Dude, I think Guyborg could take some lightweights out…….did you see her traps, those lats, that large muscle between her legs?
large muscle between her legs…her penis?
Hahaha! I’m gonna have to google this guyborg Shim/She-male/tranny whatever the hell it is that you guys keep talking about.
look her up on youtube…looks like she hits hard than most guys haha shes a f*ckin riot
MMA does not need a billion other organizations, for many reasons.
1)when you put on garbage shows, like the elite XC did on CBS the 1st time, you turn away the casual mainstream fan that’s watching for the 1st time. There is a a reason it dropped 67% between fights and I’m pretty sure it wasn’t just cause of Kimbo (more on him later). Its cause what the 5 million ppl who aren’t true MMA fans saw that night was basicly a freak show. They saw what looked like a fixed fight (in Kimbo Thompson), a questionable stoppage in by far the best fight of that night (lawler smith), and 2 women beating each other up (while it wasn’t a bad fight, I think it did make a lot of ppl cringe). Add the poor production value, god awful commentary, and random strippers they had dancing around the ramp every commercial break and you have what looks a lot like a more violent WWE (which isn’t a good thing).
2nd) too many “Champions” is horrible and one of the reasons boxing is dead. And WAMMA isn’t the ****en anwser. You can’t just make up a “governing” body without the main company. Cause yes Fedor is a legit top heavyweight, but every other weight class is ruled by UFC fighters. No one thinks KJ Noons or Shinya Aoki is beating BJ Penn or anyone in any organization is gonna beat Anderson. And for the most part ppl just automaticly recognize the UFC Champ as the best in that weight class anyway. But WAMMA is a joke (not to mention that was thee worst looking best I have ever seen)
3rd) I have had many arguments with my friends over if the UFC becomes the only buisness in town, it will some how make them stop trying. What you need to understand is that the UFC is a PPV based company. So if you don’t put cards on that people wanna watch then guess what you go under. And from what everything Dana has said, it seems like he isn’t just content at shutting down other promotions and saying “Yay, we are the best!” and not caring after. He’s said he wants to be bigger then the NFL world wide.
4th) in regards to Kimbo, he is a joke and is one of the reason for elite XC downfall. You can’t make the face of your franchise an unproven fighter, For the simple fact that if he can’t beat anyone but rubbish fighters your screwed. So the UFC will not overpay Kimbo to get destroyed by Cain Valasquez or Cheick Kongo. But maybe affliction will and will piss even more money down the drain.
aznstar, all good points. i can’t ever see the UFC looking around and saying they don’t have to try anymore. even if they were the only game in town, if they put out crap, there’s gonna be no game in town cuz the sport will die.
If he drained that ear before the fight and it went back up that quick then
1 that is grosser than the hotdog-hallway remark
2 He should have never been cleared and if he was it should have been stipulated to the audience…Sending him out there was garbage…CBS knows better if Gary Shaw didn’t…
aznstar_inc ,
Great point about the potential alphabet soup of leagues and champions.
i dont care about money whos a douche whos not which show “sucks” and which is good by production, i like watching fights. in elitexc and affliction people get knocked out in good fashion. and so what if people in the ufc can beat most or all of them, thats why there not in the ufc, doesnt everyone deserve a chance ina sport this big, can you only fight if its in ufc? i agree ufc is the biggest talent pool in the business and i go to crabby joes to watch all the ppvs and i have like 8 posters now, but ill still watch affliction, elite xc and anything else whether its free on tv, ppv at a friends or my house, or on the internet. its just about seeing cool fights with me and learning about the styles, its a big sport and anyone whos trying hard should have an equal opportunity
Dana has even said that after they bought the ufc for $2 mil, the Fertitti brothers had to inject about $50 mil to keep it going.
If EliteXC or Affliction has $50 mil, maybe more needed now, only then will they have a chance to survice.
Promoting fights is probably tougher than being in a fight !!
Tspence…I see your argument..at the end of the day, I really don’t care if it says ufc, affliction, elite xc….I just like to see good fights…its just the ufc has so many talented fighters and just that makes for a better fight…
in my mind i just like how the ufc has master there production crew and how they have goldie always state mindless facs so the new fans will learn some stuff and then joe rogan is pretty much an expert so he is just like a helper to some hardcore fans…he actually does know alot about mma…then you got bruce buffer and the ring girls…..the ufc is so big that most fans know the ring girls names!
I understand why some don’t like Dana. I guess some of us are entrenched because Zuffa bailed out the sport when no one else would…
1st this isn’t little league, this is pro sports. Not everyone deserves a chance. No one makes that argument any other major sport, why should MMA be any different? If you work hard and have talent at some point n time you will get picked up to the big show. But I do watch these other promotions and random MMA events when I get a chance and some of the fights are just terrible stunning KO or not. The point is to grow the sport and have it become mainstream. And my point is, you hurt that growth by playing into the stereotype of “human cock fighting”. So low production values and weak fights make this sport look busche league and feed the misconceptions of the sport (which is a reason NY still doesn’t sanction fights) so far the UFC is the only one that I’ve seen that doesn’t treat it as a circus, but as a legit sport. they don’t have Bands playing sets in between fights, or B list rappers rapping fighters to the ring. For the longest time whenever you saw skate board clips on TV you saw them falling down and hurting themselves. No one to skating serious till Tony Hawk showed what the real fans already knew, that their sport isn’t just nasty falls and guys getting hurt. There is an art behind it and when the best put on a show it can be great TV. And while the UFC and MMA have made steady strides to become mainstream, there are a lot of promotions that just see a quick buck and wanna get in.
Tspence you are my hero. I couldn’t have said that better myself. Most Excellent…
aznstar…I never said a billion. I’d just like to see 2 or 3 big ones and the rest the smaller promtions for use of building up fighters. Competition breeds cheaper prices and more fighter pay and health insurance. Those are 3 big ones for me. Dana White will NEVER lower his PPV pricing if nobody else gets big and then does so. He will also not ever provide good salaries and fighter health insurance IF NOBODY ELSE GETS BIG AND THEN DOES SO.
It really can’t get much simpler than that. Monopolies are not good…EVER. History has proven that time and time again. Remember when Ma Bell forced you to RENT your phones? Only you old f*ckers will remember that one…look it up.
I used to love Dana… admired him… but when you get to be as big as him you should help the people under you…not intentionally hurt them so you can line your pocket with more money.
Also…He is now saying that John McCain is who he backs to help grow the UFC. Doesn’t anyone else find this a huge pile of dog sh*t on a “I’m richer than sh*t and don’t want to pay more taxes” platter? I mean this is the guy who STILL SAYS MMA is “human cockfighting.” There has been NO REVELATION made there by McCain that would make Dana’s decision even close to being for anything but lining his own pocket. He sold his soul on that one.
But what do I know…I’m just a Hippie Terrorist who gives “I have a dream” speeches.
Oh and if you ever want to see how truly liberal, hippie, tree huggerish I am…just click my name and read my blog.
Dannyboy- you can’t compare a sport to a basic service. Is a monoply on electric or gas wrong? Yes. But every other major sport has a monoply (in fact MLB is on of the few companies that are exempt from Monoply laws by our goverment) if you spread out the top fighter between even 2 or 3 companies you water down the overall product.
You talk about Dana lining his pockets, yet why do you think Affliction went from tshirts to promoting? Cause they thought they could make a quick buck, why else do you overpay for old fighter who have name recognition to fight with one fight deals? Dana is the only one in it for the long haul.
What I want is this sport to be on espn or sports illustrated on a regular basis. I want BJ Penn or GSP to be as well known as Peyton Manning, Derek Jeter, or Kobe Bryant. And the UFC is the only one pushing to that goal. You have to respect Dana cause he is gonna fight for this sport being mainstream. I don’t even know how you could accuse the UFC of being in it to line there pockets, lets not forget that he had a deal with HBO to televise fights. However Dana wouldn’t give up the final word on production to HBO, which eventually lead to the death of that deal. You don’t think Dana could get on network TV right now if it was just about the money?
Personally I like DREAM and the WEC, cause they are there to further the sport. Its promotions like elite xc and affliciton that I bash cause they think we are stupid. And that you can just buy ratings by having megadeath play with a bunch of over the hill fighters fighting. Which is why I was very happy to hear affliciton only pulled 50,000 to 85,000 buys. Which is far short of what they said they needed to break even on the card (250,000 to 300,000 buys)
As for fighters salaries, how many people are actually compalining? worth is whatever someone is willing to pay. And right now fighers don’t seem to be calmmering to go to elite xc or affliction. In fact every other thing on these site are how the UFC just signed this fighter or that fighter from the IFL. But to make a point, if you take a mid level fighter making 30K per fight not counting whatever bonuses the UFC doesn’t report (every fighter fights about 3-4 times a year 120K a year roughly) I believe the min. salary for veteran NFL player is 500,000 a year. But you spread that out over 16 games and guess what you get, 31K per game very close. And that’s a multibillion dollar league that has been around for 70+ years. Not an upstart company that been around for maybe 10. So lets get persepective on the situations before crucifing him cause Tito Ortiz didn’t get what he wants.
aznstar…I agree with almost everything you said especially in terms of ESPN and Sports Illustrated.
However, you are completely missing my point. My point is 1 person. Dana. MLB, NFL, etc are run by commissions with MANY people having input into what happens to the organization. With the UFC it’s pretty much “What Dana says, goes” and that is NOT right by any means.
Affliction and EliteXC have done what they needed to do to skip a few grades as a fighter organization…and guess what? They put on quality shows and I’ve enjoyed watching all of them.
Your comment on watering down the sport is completely invalidated by UFC joining WAMMA (or something like it). Remember MMA is an INTERNATIONAL sport…not just the U.S. There will ALWAYS be other organizations with top fighters unwilling to go to the UFC.
Having a “Superbowl” with a unified Championship belt will create extremely good fight cards with multiple organizations on the ticket. THIS IS NOT A BAD THING.
If Dana were a “Board of Directors” I might agree with EVERYTHING you said. But it’s not a Board of Directors… It’s an immature little wannabe who thinks he runs everything, sees everything and IS everything MMA. He got lucky with TUF being a success…I’m glad it was… Who knows where UFC and MMA would be without it. I commend him for that…but that’s as far as it goes anymore.
HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY COMPLAINAING ABOUT SALARIES? That’s a ridiculous statement… THEY ALL complain. Every single one of them. Don’t you complain about your salary? I know I do. Everyone does.
It looks like the UFC owns Boardwalk, Park Place, and they’re about to finish buying out the greens. Affliction is over there with a few Orange properties. This should be an interesting game. Dream needs to own more than just a few light blues and 1 utility.
See the analogy?
DannyBoy-
What you gotta understand yes there are owners who have a say but in the end 1 man controls each of the major sprorts organizations (NFL, MLB, NBA) whether that be Roger Godell, to david stern, to Bud Selig, one man makes 95% of the desicions. And Dana Whites fits in line with them. And you are selling Dana short on what he’s done for this sport. He’s the one that brought rules to what was a freakshow. He’s the one that lobbied to get the UFC/MMA back on TV (lets not forget that this sport wasn’t even allowed on PPV a few years ago). Because of his efforts 48 states now sanction MMA events (New York and Mass. Being the only to states that remain) before Dana and Zuffa I believe only 2 states sanctioned fights. So for the same reasons you (and many other people) dislike him, is the same reason this sport is where it is. He had one mind set and wouldn’t take no for an answer the entire way. What you gotta understand is when your trying to grow a company having 12 people putting their opinions in on where we should go with it, just takes to long to deal with. Almost every major company started with 1 man and 1 vision. That’s why the Fertitas who are business geniuses didn’t get invovled in the early days, despite the fact that he was losing money hand over fist. Dana is cocky and arrogant, but guess what look at anyone who is successful and you will find that exact same personality. Dana has a goal to get this sport into the mainstream and he will be one of the major reasons this sport will get there.
And your statement on pay is ridiculous. So what if everyone complains about what they make, we are all greedy and want more. That doesn’t mean we deserve it. Dana is running a business and for that buisness to continue to run in the black, you can’t give in to everyones wants. And like I said if he’s paying slave wages why does every fighter come to the UFC? In fact fedor would have come to the UFC, but wanted a contract that allowed him to fight in whatever promotion he wanted. The UFC contracts have an exculsivity clause and that was a deal breaker. With that in mind inus Randy, how many fighters have walked out due to the fact that they were underpaid? I mean if you think that fighters are that unhappy why aren’t more of them leaving? there are other promotions. Now the question is how much do you think elite XC pays? Or strikeforce? I’m pretty sure its close if not less. But to further my point, you feel you should make more right? Go up to your boss and tell him your under paid and will walk if you don’t get a raise. See how quickly you get tossed out the building. Never overestimate your value.
no one likes shaw anyway and i know the ufc will scoop them all up they will even grab kimbo up to unfortunatly he has drawing power so thats how that goes but diaz lawler shields i can see all them getting picked up but sorry to the females cause no way is the ufc going to add a female division
Part 2 in response to Dannyboy-
In response to Dana not liking you and you being done. Well guess what that’s the breaks. Everyone has a boss and if the boss doesn’t like your attitude at work he has the right to discipline you. David Stern said you can’t dress like a “thug” a few years back. Which meant no gaudy jewelry, no jeans, no hats and required all athletes to wear suits to and from the arena. Is that fair? No, but who ever said life is fair…let alone buisness. And who was the last person Dana kicked out of the UFC because he didn’t like them? He hates Tito personally but still honored his contract and kept in on the main card.
As for the WAMMA group, if I’m the UFC and have 98% of the #1 fighters in each divison why would I ever want to share a co promotion with elite xc and/or affliction? I spent all this cash promoting my fighters and now you want to come and piggyback off me…I don’t ****en think so. So for instance every top 10 list for the light heavyweight divison has no one but UFC fighters in it. And if no other promotions have any challengers for the WAMMA belt in that divison, what’s the point of a cross promotional show then? Also if you haven’t noticed most of the “stars” in other shows are guys that were mid level fighters in the UFC that washed out. Nick Diaz, Robbie Lawler, Josh Smith, hell that includes bour 80% of the affliction card (including Babalu who was booted cause he is a classless ****). With the exception of Fedor Vs. Couture, what super fights are out there? Who you putting in the ring with BJ Penn? KJ Noons? Really? Cause he’s beat a journeyman fighter due to cut and KO’d Yves Edwards who was coming off a 1 fight win streak against a nobody. Shinya Aoki? Who just lost to a guy that lost his previous fight and was a stand in? Robbie Lawler Anderson Silva really? Is that even fair? Maybe if Robbie had a tag partner in Hughes that could even it up. GSP Jake Shields would be an OK fight but I rather see GSP Penn in UFC 91. and like I said before NO OTHER PROMOTION HAS ANYONE CLOSE TO THE TALENT THE UFC HAS AT THE LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT SPOT. So if I’m the UFC what’s in it for me? Doesnt everyone already recognize each of my champs as the best at their respective weights already? (with the exception of Heavyweight) What more is there to prove?
aznstar_inc,
good job i agree actually i really enjoyed reading that thank you!
for real i did enjoy im not being sarcastic that was a pretty enjoyable read
Personal freedom gets curtailed when you go to work for someone else…That’s just life…
I’m not going to type up some long response again. I wasn’t wanting WAMMA (or perhaps something similar) to be implemented tomorrow. I want some other organization to do well so that perhaps that can happen in the future.
And as for your comment on the top 10 being all UFC. That’s a load of crap. Check your Heavyweight and Lightweight top 10s… not only are they not all UFC…but UFC fighters are in the MINORITY.
And one last thought…if you think 1 person in the NFL/MLB has 95% of the decision making power you should check your facts.
Top 10 list i’m referring to is Inside MMA’s Top 10 list for HW and LW.
Oh and your facts really should be in order before going off on some tangents. Yves Edwards was on a 3 fight win streak and if you actually saw the Eddie Alvarez/Hansen fight you’d see it could have easily been Hansen who would have been there. I had no problem with that stand in whatsever. Okay bedtime… nite all!
Dammit sorry one last thing. Your statement on the Afflictin PPV buys being 50,000 – 85,000 is also in dire need of a fact check. That number was made up out of thin air by a guy from the Wrestling Observer… You find me a FACT showing that and then you can use it as a counter-point.
ufc 87
Dannyboy vs aznstar_inc
i got dannyboy by first round gogoplata!
Dannyboy I stated in ALL CAPS the LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT Divison is from top to bottom all UFC fighters. And I said the only exclusion I would have in best overall by weight class would be the heavyweight.
But like I said before, name me the cross promotional matchups that will lead to a mega card
BJ Penn Vs.
GSP Vs.
Anderson Silva Vs.
Fill in the blank that will wow everyone. There isn’t a fight that would out draw Penn VS. GSP.
As for the NFL, Roger Godell doesn’t have the power to punish as he pleases? From Pac Man getting suspsended for a year to Marshawn Lynch not getting in trouble for a hit n run earlier this year is all his call. Spygate and the tapes being destroyed is all his call, which is why senator spector wanted to investigate the situation. So yes he has as much control over suspensions and firings in his league as Dana does in the UFC.
Great Yves won 1 fight in the elite xc and 2 in another lesser organization, that puts him in line for a title shot at KJ noons. And would you pay money to watch Gus Hansen fight BJ Penn? Really? Cause BJ wouldn’t destroy him?
As for my numbers its was taken from Yahoosports.com as the prelim figures from local cable compaines in the “state of MMA” blog. Affliction is claiming 100,000. And even that is less than half of what the projected they needed.
You know Dannyboy you have avoided a lot of the questions I asked like, why if fighters are so underpaid by the UFC don’t ANY walk out of their contracts and hold out like Randy? But none more so then WHY DO WE NEED ANOTHER GOVERNING BODY TO WATCH OVER MMA? The UFC is doing a great job as being thee organization in the sport. Its an ideally run franchise. Production, on screen personalities, match making, all of it is far and away best in the sport. What is Dana not giving us? If Jake Shields never fights GSP will stop watching? If you never see Anderson Silva Pummel Robbie Lawler you gonna lose a night of sleep? The answer is no and we don’t need some made up governing body trying to meddle with everything. Hell at this point all this discussion is gonna be a mute point in a year, when Elite Xc and Affliction both tank like the IFL and go belly up.
Okay lets be real here people. Is Dana pretty arrogant…DUH. In a business like that you have to be a little cocky, it comes with success. Did Affliction or Elite XC get the numbers it wanted…not really. Is competition good for the sport…hell yeah. Am I using … too much, yes. Seriously though the competition is good but I look at it like this. Has anyone worked for a business that shuts down before you deposit your check? Yeah it’s great they put all those numbers on their checks but if you cannot pay it whats the use. Yeah you can sue and what not but as a fighter one missed check and you’re screwed for months. It’s why Noons has been dying to get back in there. I actually enjoyed the Elite XC card this past Saturday, it was a decent card but I’m still not sold on it being a lasting promotion.
Dana love him or hate him is a smart businessman and that’s why the UFC makes so many cuts because there is no use for paying someone that is not going to be of use to selling cards. It’s simple business. Not to mention the UFC is not trying to destroy the smaller organizations(cage rage, king of the cage, really even DREAM) just the ones that try to infringe on their “territory”, once again basic first day of class business lesson. You think Dana doesn’t realize that the smaller promotions are where the lifeline of the sport is? If you do you’re a moron.
Honestly, I think WAMMA was one of the dumbest things ever. It’s honestly like trying to make the NBA change their rules to International Rules. UFC changed their rules to satisfy State Athletic Commissions when they first came back to the US, they don’t have reason to change them again. If you really wanted to institute something like that it’d made more sense to get all the heads of the different promotions together and work something out. Also just wanted to say about McCain, it’s actually rather funny because apparently he has reversed his stance on MMA, do I believe that’s just to try and get votes, hell yeah but still he has reversed his stance since the UFC changed it’s rules.
-p.s. aznstar and Dannyboy you both realize that you both can be right because there is no one rankings poll. There is no Bull Crap Standings like in college football for MMA lol.
MORE ORGS = MORE FIGHTS =BETTER MMA!
When we see corruption and fraud in the UFC then Dana needs to answer to somebody till then let freedom reign. He has said he is using boxing as a model including what not to do so I think it will be just fine….
Okay aznstar for the sake of being at work with time constraints I will simply answer your questions instead of replying to the entire post with yet another long ass ‘who cares’ entry.
Why do fighters not walk out?
That’s an easy one…Dana is a hardass and everyone knows it. To question anything like that without anywhere else solid to go would be suicide because he would kick your ass out so fast your head would spin. This is common knowledge and since fighters can’t say, “Well I will just go HERE then.” they have ZERO leverage to work with. 1-2 more top organizations will give fighters leverage.
Why do we need another governing body to watch over MMA?
That one is simple and is entirely my opinion: Dana White is too immature and biased to be allowed the power to solely govern all of MMA. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only one to be on that side of the issue.
What is Dana not giving us?
Another simple one that I’ve already answered. He’s not giving out Fighter Health insurance, decent salaries and good contracts that allow freedom for the fighters to fight where the money is when Dana decides he doesn’t want them fighting for 10-18 months and they need to.
Will I watch if I never see those matchups?
Of Course I will…I’m a fan of ALL MMA…not just one organization. I even watch the crappy ones with Bas Rutten and Kenny Rice.
And one last note. GSP vs Penn? Seems to me like the Lightweight/Welterweight divisions are in dire need of good fights so badly that they have to mix the division champions in order to get a good fight worth watching.
It will be a LONG time before you see me proclaim, “The UFC is treating their fighters fairly.” and to me that is a problem. An OPINIONATED problem that neither you or I will ever agree on.
I just wish you’d see the reason the UFC doesn’t release their PPV numbers is because the fighters would see exactly how much money is being taken away from each show. If they saw that there would be a mutiny. Dana White is making a HUGE amount of profit and if he was any sort of decent person he would at least offer better fighter salaries and free fighter health insurance for ALL fighters in the UFC. He can keep his ****ty contracts if he at least does that.
I know I didn’t fill in the blanks because, quite frankly, I can’t. And that’s exactly why I want these orgs to grow. You’re asking me to take an organization that’s had FIVE shows and one that’s had ONE show and compare their fighters to the UFC fighters? Again you miss my point. I want that to happen SOME DAY… I didn’t say it would be today or tomorrow.
Okay back to work went longer than I thought and for that I apologise. I hope I answered all your questions.
p.s. Gunslinger…thanks for picking me winning by a Nick Diaz & Shinya Aoki move… you bastard!
Gunslinger-
More promotions don’t mean better for MMA, if anything splitting up the fighters gives you worse MMA. Cause now you have to have some stupid governing organization that has to work with a bunch of different organization to get one fight together, in other words boxing. But if the UFC has all the main talent and is the NFL of the sport. Then uses smaller shows (cage rage, dream, rumble on the rock, etc) as a minor league system that will eventually funnel their champs to the UFC, you have what every other sport has and you get all the major fights we want. That is the ideal model for this sport.
Dannyboy-
I like how you just assume a lot of stuff. You questions the numbers I give, yet you work on the assumption that everyone hates Dana cause you do. Fighters still have several other organizations to pick from, so yes if I’m that upset with my contract I would go to DREAM or affliction . So I don’t know where your coming from with that, since fighters do have options on where they want to fight. Randy is trying to do it now in fact, but he’s the only 1 (and he’s mainly doing it cause he wants to beat fedor and go out as the best fighter ever) which means Dana isn’t this evil power weilding tyrant like you make him out to be. Can you name me 1 fighter other than Randy or Tito that has gone out and just bashed Dana even after they have moved on?
When I asked what is Dana not giving us, I meant us as fans and the paying public. He is giving us the fights we want and trying to spread out the live shows to new areas to help grow the sport.
As for Penn GSP, can you make fights within each weight that would be great fights? Yes you can. Huerta/Florian fighting BJ and Thiago Alves fighting GSP would both be great cards. But what GSP Penn is, is 2 pound for pound greats fighting each other in their respective primes. That would be a Mega fight and a fight that a lot of fans want to see. So once again proving my point that we are getting what we want as UFC fans.
Yes you and I will never really see eye to eye. But the truth is probably more in the middle. And I understand that you are trying to lobby as spokes person for a fighter union, but there are a lot of things that are done behind closed doors that you and I don’t know about, so speculating on these topics is basicly pointless.
aznstar_inc ,
That makes no scense to have a minor league of mma?…..that is the dumbest thinge ive ever heard…..The sport is mma not ufc..if you have one main promotion everyone will keep refering to the sport as ufc..but its not its mma….and i like having other orgs having big talent it gives a scense of mystery…like when pride was around and everyone wondered what would happen in a liddell silva fight……I bet your the kind of person who saw never back down and thought it was great for the sport….if not whatever….but the point is a minor league is a stupid idea…and no one will ever agree to it because it doesnt make scense…what are you gonna say next that there should be a ufc draft..shut up….the sport is mma…i love ufc and all but there has to be other orgs…..competition between orgs equals better fights and pay days for the fighters….when it all comes down to it mma will be back to its glory days soon of ufc vs pride as top 2 orgs…..now coming soon ufc vs dream!!!!….why would dream ever…ever ever ever ever agree to be a minor league..please stop talking
also aznstar i noticed you said something about what we want as ufc fans most people here are MMA FANS NOT JUST UFC FANS!
also if you notice in nfl there are teams in mma there is one fighter vs one fighter and there are other football promotions..just not that big…arena football is pretty big they just had there arena bowl witht he soul winning a close one and there is a europe football league and a canadian football league
Gunslinger-
1st, the question of what we want as UFC fans wasn’t reffering to this board or anyone on it. The question was “what isn’t Dana White doing for for the UFC fans”. So how about you read the posts before chimming in on things.
2nd, having mystery is the dumbest idea ever. Was talking about Chuck Wandy better than actually seeing it? Of course not. So instead of talking about the what if’s with 3 different organizations, how bout we just get them under 1 organization and take out the middle man. Having mystery is what boxing has now, cause they rarely ever get the mega fight together cause boxing promoters can’t agree on spliting cash and tv rights and all this other BS. That’s why people got turned off to boxing, and that will eventually turn people off to MMA.
3rd- UFC isn’t MMA and the NFL isn’t football. But that doesn’t mean that those organizations don’t represent both sports.
4th- the minor league idea is already pretty much in use with the WEC. As for other organizations such as Dream joinning the UFC and why would they ever do that. Well what about this buisness is stable? Dannyboy likes to talk about the future. Well what if they fold just like Pride did? You don’t think they would take the cash to stay open? They wouldn’t love the idea of bringing in top flight american fighters to make their names? Cause Dream is struggling in Japan right now and the Japanese audience always loved american fighters (bob sapp, Rampage, etc)
really wec is a minor league tell me what fighter has went from wec to ufc after becoming champ…hmm no one at least not while the ufc has been under control of wec….its more like a trash bin for fighters who lose in the ufc….see jamie varner,Tiki Ghosn and brock larson….ya the bin has some great fighters that havent fought in the ufc….condit,cantwell,filho but the point is a minor league is stupid and yes to most people mma = ufc…why do you think when ever people talk about mma on espn people like tony kornheiser refer to it as ufc not mma……they say stuff like ultimate fighting is brutal…its not ultimate fighting its ufc……also pride didnt fold they got bought out…..a monopoly of mma would not work because then the ufc would just pay even less than they already do…competition is good for mma ask any professional fighter see the new roger huerta article..where is he supposed to go if the ufc is the only org..hmm wec ha huerta would smash varner and anyone else in the wec
Answer me this, boxing has multiple organizations the same way you guys seem to want MMA to go towards. How is that working for them? I hear a lot of talk about fighters wages and all that. And if its just the UFC as the big show no one will get paid. Well its a 2 way street, the UFC needs its stars to fight. So if they **** over everyone than yes fighters will quit or strike. imma state this again, this isn’t HS sports where everyone has a right for a shot to be involved. This is a buisness and in the long run the buisness has to make money to survive. Everyone made a big deal about affliction having the highest pay roll for a card ever. Well guess what, they lost a lot of money and now are saying publicly; fighters will need to take different deals for future events (yahoosports.com is the source of that statement, before you ask) which means they learned what the UFC has already understood, you can’t just open the check book. So why don’t we stop assuming that if affliction and elite xc fold that MMA is ruined cause Dana White is evil and wants to just get rich. Lorenzo Furetita didn’t leave a job that pays him 128 mil a year cause the UFC pays better, He wants to grow the sport too. I learned that ever action has a reaction. So if the UFC becomes a Major sport to rival the NFL or MLB, if fighters don’t get what they want they would do the smart thing and unionize and get theirs that way. I much rather see a Fighters Union than 3 organizations with some BS governing body and having them trying to figure out which fighter deserves what, and how the gate and PPV revenues are split.which means fights never come together and we just repeated this miss steps of boxing. Cause please believe I fear that reality more than the UFC being the only big show.
The definition of crazy is doing the exact same thing expecting a different result.
I used to think of the WEC as minor league till I went to a show…Its different kind of like arena to NFl (the comparison is for the event not the fandom). It is a very fast exciting event.
reading the comments makes it more obvious: UFC-MMA hardcore fans are like the worst of PMS girls! They go all emotional and on a tangent. They think they are more intelligent than anyone else and completely believe their own thoughts to be the absolute truth. On top of it they also think they can make the best decisions for the sport. And started already “distributing” the fighters. Did anyone said EliteXC is going out of business?
I can’t wait for the time these same fans will be ****ing like pms girls about the fact that both Shaw and DeLuca were not fired and are indeed still involved in the process. And i have reasons to believe that will be sometime soon.
Aspirine doesn’t help stupidity.
I can’t believe you said Fedor’s fights aren’t exciting. I’ve seen almost all of his fights and every single one of them (even the decisions ala Cro Cop) were fast paced and exciting.
You saying that denies you the right to even speak on MMA again.
As always…just my opinion.