Ultimate Chaos Results: Lashley Dominates Sapp; Yvel, Horodecki, and Atencio Also Win
Heavyweight prospect Bobby Lashley kept his undefeated record intact on Saturday, forcing Bob Sapp to submit to strikes midway through the opening round of their bout, which headlined Ultimate Chaos at the Mississippi Gulf Coast Coliseum in Biloxi, Mississippi.
The card also featured victories by notables Gilbert Yvel, Chris Horodecki, Javier Vasquez, and Affliction vice president Tom Atencio.
The results for Ultimate Chaos were:
MAIN CARD
- Bobby Lashley def. Bob Sapp via submission (strikes) — Round 1, 3:17
- Gilbert Yvel def. Pedro Rizzo via KO (strikes) — Round 1, 2:10
- Colin Mckee def. Lance Thompson via submission (strikes) — Round 1. 4:16
- Javier Vazquez def. Mark Kergosien via submission (guillotine choke) — Round 1
- Chris Horodecki def. William Sriyapai via submission (rear naked choke) — Round 1, 4:02
- Waachiim Spiritwolf def. Brett Cooper via TKO (strikes) — Round 1, 3:41
- Tom Atencio def. Randy Hedderick via TKO (corner stoppage) — Round 2, 5:00
- Brandon Harder def. John Harris via submission (arm triangle choke) — Round 2, 4:31
- James Orso def. Danny Abbadi via unanimous decision (30-27, 29-28, 29-28)
PRELIMINARY CARD
- Drew Wallace def. Eric Graham via TKO (strikes) — Round 2
- Rocky Overstreet def. Greg Maher via submission (kimura) — Round 1
- Johnathon Mackles def. Shilo Pisarich via submission (rear naked choke) — Round 2
- Trent Billiot def. Weldon Galle via submission (guillotine choke) — Round 2
- Joey Parker def. Jim McLemore via unanimous decision
[Pictured: Bobby Lashley and Bob Sapp]
Tags: Bob Sapp, Bobby Lashley, Brett Cooper, Chris Horodecki, Colin McKee, Danny Abbadi, Din Thomas, Drew Wallace, Eric Bradley, Eric Graham, Gilbert Yvel, Greg Maher, James Orso, Javier Vazquez, Kelly Leo, Lance Thompson, Mark Kergosien, Pedro Rizzo, Randy Hedderick, Rocky Overstreet, Tom Atencio, Waachiim Spiritwolf, William Sriyapai
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Harder / Harris was a wicked good fight… they threw down like no tomorrow…
Harder-Harris was good. Not the most technical bout, but exciting nonetheless.
what happened with the kelly leo v eric bradley fight?
Undercard details are kind of sketchy. I’ve provided all the results I’ve been able to find, but will either pass along the result or a reply on what happened to the fight if/when I find out. Thanks for reading!
Kelly got the beating of a lifetime the guy Kelly fought just stood and banged Kelly up pretty good and Kellys takedowns and subs didnt help this time around. The guy Kelly fought was alot different fighter than what Kelly has fought against previously. Eric comes from top shelf training and training partners. I still give it up to Kelly he got in there and did what he could do against Eric.
Man those were some brutal shots from Yvel. I was wincing after the firts one.
Gilbert still looked realy brawlish though. But impressive none the less.
Slow stoppage by the referee. Good knockout for Yvel, but could have been stopped a few punches earlier.
Then everyone would cry “it was controvertial” blah blah………
I like this way better…….no controversy. I know the fighter would get hurt, injury will be more but hey you agreed to a fight.
Chy- first rule is to protect yourself at all times for fighters and for referees the first rule is to always ensure the safety of the fighters.
If it’s “controversial” then that is why the rematch was created.
whos next for bobby lashley? I thought/hoped atencio would get beat down. now its up to joe rogan to take care of that a-hole.
lol, he did show a lot of heart for a millionaire in his 40’s
I’m hopeful Strikeforce is next for Lashley. Who he’ll fight first I don’t know but these fights aren’t helping up determine if he’s a legit prospect.
Atencio did get beat down pretty good early in his fight but stuck it out and won. Pretty gutsy performance by the “T-Shirt Guy,” who called out Dana White after the fight.
Strikeforce would be the perfect place for Lashley to step up to next. Besides I hear Sylvia and AA have openings…
I agree that Strikeforce could be a good home for Lashley.
Some of my thoughts on the fights, that I posted via my Twitter:
Yvel just knocked out Rizzo pretty brutally, late stoppage by the ref Yvel will go on to face Buantello @ Affliction Trilogy #ultimatechaos
Yvel just said that after his fight against Buantellos he wants to go “up to the UFC to get the big belts”. Side note – crowd looks sparce.
Lashley defeats Sapp via tapout due to strikes after a quick takedown and some GnP. Sapp tapped on 2 occasions b4 stoppage. #ultimatechaos
I missed the Atencio fight barely saw the Waachiim Spiritwolf fight, then saw the rest from there. Horodecki did what I expected him to do. Vazquez definitely should have won that fight, and Kergosien handed him that guillotine on a silver platter. McKee v. Thompson was interseting, Petruzelli said something about an illegal knee but I never saw the replay, so I don’t know what that was all about… weird ending.
Lashley looked ok against Sapp. Didn’t seem to have a lot of “finishing” power as far as his strikes, but showed a good game plan and a lot of strength to get that take down. From the post fight it sounds like his managers are taking things intelligently and bringing him along slowly, and already have an idea of who they want him to face in his next two fights. He looked good, but did exactly what everyone expected in this fight, still doesn’t look like a world beater, we’ll see where he goes from here.
hey is Lashley going to be on this season of TUF
I hop so, he raely shuld b man!!!11!
thats exactly what i was going to ask, also i was suprised lashley didnt finish jasaon guida in there bout because he seems pretty serious, is jason any good? because his record sure doesnt say it.
Jason Guida is not all that good. He shows flashes of being good, but it really appears he doesn’t take his training as seriously as his brother Clay. Clay has a decent guillotine but he’s very sloppy with it and against a guy like lashley it’s really a terrible move to attempt.
also timosy Justin and I were joking… everybody and their mother has asked that question the last few weeks and as we keep pointing out filming started weeks ago.
I felt that Lashley looked good, but stil not ready for the big leagues. He did show good control and seemed to implement his game pretty well. It would have been nice to see the ref catch the first tapout from Sapp though because you don’t want to see a fighter take more punishment than he has to, but sometimes it just goes that way. I hope Lashley keeps imprving and keeps winning, but soon he’ll have to face more elite competition to move up and gain more “cred”, but he still looked good.
I expected Hordecki to win and he did, the dude is very talented and he’s going places.
Lashley can win against some UFC HWs like Mustafa Al Turk, Cheick Kongo etc…. If they have a room in UFC then it’s not unfair to go and tryout in UFC.
You said it yourself he can win against “some” UFC heavyweights. His management doesn’t want him to get into the UFC and win two out of four they want him to go in and be a legit championship contender because the better prepared he is for the UFC the longer he’ll be there and that means more money for them. If he wanted to launch in the UFC quickly he had the chance to go the TUF route and his management felt it was in his best interest to come along slowly. His chin has yet to truly be tested and he’s faced no real submission threats. Until we see that from him I think he’ll continue to try and build experience outside the octagon.
IMO saying he would beat Kongo is a stretch. He took the fight with Cain on very short notice and that hurt him greatly. Not to mention Cain is a much better MMA fighter at this point than Lashley.
chrisl what do you mean lashleys never been in any submission threats jason guida had a perfect guilloteen on him and he got out of that. also velasquez would beat kongo anytime, kongo is so over-rated, lets not forget he got his ass whooped by herring.
really a perfect guillotine??? guess that’s why it wasn’t finished…
Ya i didnt know that an arm in half guard guillotine was considerd “perfect”. Where do train BJJ man? As for the Kongo comment ya he would lose to Velasquez most times out of ten but to say he got his ass whupped by herring is a bit much. The fight was a three round split decision wrestling match. If that garners an ass whuppin than I dont know anything about MMA.
carls i train bjj three days a week under a brown belt
Really Timosy, com’on man is all of this BS called for, are you giving childish threats over the internet?
I will leave the comment as is for an oppotunity for Carls to read it in its entirityI have now edited your comment (3:42pm {pst}), keep clean or I will have you put on moderation- FR702timosy, you have put yourself in moderation by changing your name if you are going to keep the name timosykilla post again and I will ok that name, we would like for you to use one specific name just fyi, and for those that don’t know he has apologized under the name timosykilla…….
Its cool FR702, I knew I was probably crossing the line when I made that post. But in all honesty Timosy you have to see where Im coming from with the “perfect guillotine” comment. Either way I meant no offence to you in your training of BJJ(although it came out that way)I just like raggin on people who make silly comments once in a while.(just ask Marvel:D) At the end of the day I respect everyone on this site cause I know if your posting here you must train some aspect of MMA or love watching it from the “big show” right down to the “what the hell am i watching” events. Anyone one on here must be a die hard for MMA one way or another and thats exactly the kind of people i want to post with.
Sorry for the low blow to your training man.
alright then nice to know that you guys can get along, the lot of you have been posting nice stuff recently and if you disagree that is ok, I just don’t care for “threats” or whatever.. Timosy good on ya (just pick one name tho please) and carls all is well continue to enjoy the site and post the good stuff that you all seem to know much appreciated have a good one
FR702
I just hope no one comes in saying Lashley isn’t strong enough to wrestle with ANYONE in the UFC. That takedown on Sapp was pure strength.
chrisl, what makes cain a much better MMA fighter than lashley? I’m not saying he is an uncrowned champ of anything but Cain hasn’t beaten anyone in his young career, except Kongo who everyone knows is way out of his element on the ground. I have been on a couple sites where people say they want to see Lashley’s chin tested, I can agree with that AND I’d like to see Brock’s chin tested. Look at Brock’s 3 fights in the UFC he hasn’t even been hit with a solid strike yet.
Brock is the exception to the rule trust me, Lesnar wanted to jump in w/ the sharks because he had the confidence and he’d been training in MMA for awhile longer than Lashley has.. Lashley has yet to really be tested and he wants to come along slowly. It’s what he wants, he has the strength and the wrestling, but he’s not putting it all together yet. He’s looked good in flashes and then in others he’s really showing his inexperience. Put him in the UFC and he may win 50% of the time but he wants to start out slower.
As to what makes Cain better… he’s more accurate with his ground and pound, he has the experience edge(showed when Lashley didn’t pass the half guard when it was wide open, Cain has dynamite in his hands and more of a killer instinct during stand up. Cain also has a lot more of high level wrestling background. Lashley needs more seasoning as a fighter and he can easily surpass Cain but right now he’s not there.
I think Randy gave him one good one in the first round, but ya i know what mean.
Not ready for the big leagues. He looks a hell of a lot better than Lesner.
Lashley looks better than Lesnar? That’s a big statement my friend. Lesnar destroyed Herring, almost beat Frank Mir and took the belt from Randy Couture. Lashley almost got choked out by Jason Guida…!!!!JASON GUIDA!!!!.
What the hell are you smoking dude? Sure Lashley has some finishes but there against guys who have never fought before like his first fight against josh franklin(which was stopped by a cut by the way) or have like 7 fights and give up 50 pounds like mike cook. We all know Sapp had a punchers chance and that was about it. But on his back hes about as effective as a turtle. And when he actually fights someone who has more than a couple fights he goes all three rounds and looks rather unimpressive.(JASON-LOSING RECORD-GUIDA). Lashley is progressing dude but take it easy.
Shane Carwin would rip Lashley’s head off and ****e in the hole, HARD!
I wonder if Mazzagatti would stop it then?
While I strongly agree that Lashley is not yet “ready for prime time”, I strongly DISagree with the fact that “he looks a hell of a lot better than Lesnar” as red posted above.
Lord knows I have no love for the “Vanilla Gorilla”, and have said as much in posts to the point where certain people have asked me to stop bashing him, and I will for the sake of respecting others desist. However as much as I have issues with the way Lesnar was brought into the UFC, handles himself in and out of the cage and was fast-tracked to a title bout, there is NO way Bobby Lashley looks better in any area of MMA than Brock Lesnar. Lesnar is larger, stronger, a better wrestler, more confident, more aggressive and throws vicious fight-ending strikes like a hungry Neanderthal fighting for a hunk of sabretooth meat at the tribe’s firepit.
I’ve already told my crew that I watch and talk MMA with that if Mir submits Lesnar again, we’re heading to Vegas, and drinks are on me until sun-up.
Reagrdless, I would have to say that at this early stage in their respective careers, Lashley would be hard pressed to get out of round 1 in the cage against Lesnar.
In a year or two, who knows? Might work out that Lashley if he keeps working hard will someday come to the UFC and be the Vanilla Gorilla killa, assuming that Lesnar still has the belt and defends it against all comers.
Right now, Lashley at best would be a decent sparring partner for Dr Deathclutch, as much as it pains me to admit it…
Lashley would only be a decent sparring partner for Lesnar in so much as he could help him work on his wrestling for a potential match up with Carwin or Velasquez. Other than that Brock needs to focus on submission and submission defense, as well as continuing to improve his striking, neither of which could Lashley help him with.
Ya me and Marvel gave him a blasting earlier as you can see, but thanks for the finishing touch.:p
Ya its only a matter of time beforer lashley fights someone with “technical” strikig and KO power, or a realy good BJJ guy. But hes doing well for the time being. Strikforce does seem like the next logical place for him to go. It would give him some great exposure. What im realy wondering is if the UFC will ever be interested in him. That probably depends on who he beats and if he keeps winning.
Horodecki is good. I remember watching him back in his IFL days when he was 18 and 19 and just KOing guys left and right. I think the WEC would be good for him.
*this was in response to your comment higher up Marvel*
yea dude i’ve beena Hordecki fan since the IFL also. he’s progressing well at a young age and he’s alredy got a lot of experience and he’s just a sick fighter. The WEC would be a good place for him to grow some more though.
Great call on Horodecki in the WEC, it’d be good for him. The guy is an amazing young talent.
What happened to Eric Bradley’s fight?
Wow, this main event was more entertaining than I thought it was going to be. I’m not sure if I can post links on here, but if anyone missed it you can find it here: http://mma-hits.com/fighters/bobby-lashley/ultimate-chaos-bobby-lashley-vs-bob-sapp/
Sounds like they had a good show . Didnt get a chance to watch it myself but will check out the highlights later . Lashleys win got some yahoo/tv coverage so people are noticing his progress in the mainstream . Justin said the crowd looked thin which kinda blows . One of the problems is the cage itself …. hard to see the action unfold at a live event with the mesh ….. a ring has that advantage of view leading to a better show IMO .
One thing was noticable. They rushed the fights one after another. Fans didnt have to wait too long like anyother shows to see the fights.
Lashley is a great athlete and I think guys like him need their own weight class because he is too big for a most heavyweights so they made him fight a freakshow like Sapp. SPIRITWOLF is a great fighter, he is better than ever and his fight was the only one on this card where we saw one fighter completely dominate the other fighter. I mean it wasnt even close. The guy has great timing and in his last two fights hes been hit like 3 times total. Atencio also showed a lot of heart and gave a great performance. Shame on you SAPP.
Lashley only weighed in at 256. Gabriel Gonzaga is the same size, Frank Mir is 245, Lashley isn’t *that* much bigger than the other fighters, he’s even still 20-30 lbs smaller than Lesnar.
what happend to Din Thomas vs Javier Vasquez? they were going to fight right? 3 post down from this one it has them to fight each other? You guys know what happend?
Din Thomas had trouble cutting the weight and he got sick and pulled out the of the fight.
*Pulled out the day of the fight
how do you get a picture for your name
You can either register at http://mmafrenzy.com/wp-signup.php or go to Gravatar.com and register there using the same email you use to comment.
man i created the acnt but i wasnt sent the email. dude wat hapnd?
check your junk mail man thats where mine went.
the only fight we saw any of lashleys standup in was his joshua franklin fight, and it looked good
refs sucked the fights were really good.
lashley hasn’t been tested. it would have been interesting. to see that opening takedown thwarted.
we’ll see how hard it is to stop lashley.
Im glad Tom won his fight, that guy has some heart to get knocked down 3 times in round 1 to come back and make the other guy quit. Good job Tom and for all the Affliction haters **** off dont be mad because the so called Tshirt guy came in and make the other guy quit.
Went to the weight ins and I will be the first to say Horodecki and Stout and Rizzo and Sapp and Tom are all very classy guys. I was even able to drag Horodecki out of his room and he was very willing to do a photo op with my daughter. All very classy guys thanks for 1 hell of a show and hope to see you guys back in MS. in the future.
Its time to go and get my REFS qualifications from MSAC because Larry Ingle makes alot of bad calls and late stoppages. Larry is the only REF for our local fights in JXN he has gotten better but favors HERB DEAN back in the day either stops fights way to early or way to late. Get a grip Larry these guys train to fight and you stopped Wally Jones fight way to soon he was protecting his head and the other guy was slapping him not punching.
lashley vs lesnar!!!!!!
*sigh*
Right now my friend Lashley versus Lesnar would be like a brisk sparring session for Lesnar, and Lashley would get beat like eggs in the bowl at breakfasttime.
Give Lashley a year or two before you throw him into the cage with the world’s toughest Deathclutch T-shirt salesman…
Hey those are decent shirts.
lashley is doing good and doing the right thing by fighting his way up the ladder…
i think he will progess and become very well rounded…
horodecki…. GUH… i hate that guy… sure hes been fighting since he was 16 in the IFL(they lied about his age so he could fight) but the majority of his fights he does the same thing over and over and over and over…. and over again… clinch and trip… its so boring… like yes i know fighters should train for it and see it coming but i just cant stand him… hes the type of guy i want to see get ko’d
Dude he KOed alot of guys in the IFL so i dont know exactly what your talking about? LIke ya thats one of his primary attacks, but so is putting guys to sleep. I guess you must hate Randy Couture then to right?
randy couture and horodecki do not belong in the same league or conversation…
hes just a boring fighter, and i dont enjoy watching him… when hes on i just change the channel because ive never seen him do wonderous things in the ring…
Have you watched all his fights in the IFL though? Im just curious dude casue he was putting guys to sleep back then.
Ya good call on the Couture comment, hopefully you saw where i was going with it though.
Isn’t beating Sapp the equivalent of beating Tank Abbott?
Probably something close to that.
Is Bob Sapp a professional wrestler that fights MMA to sell tickets to pro wrestling cards, or is he legitimately trying to be an MMA fighter and wrestles professionally to make ends meet?
Just curious if anyone knows for sure…
jchol: Bob Sapp has led a convoluted life. He was a standout college linesman, thought to go high in the NFL draft. He got drafted in the 3rd round and really saw no playing time in his 4 year stint in the NHL. Right after that, he was recruited by WCW, which shortly thereafter got bought out by the WWE who had little to no interest in the development of Sapp. So he goes to Japan to fight in PRIDE and K-1 where (although losing quite often) became in instant success due to his size and ferocity.
Sapp really was never a serious anything other than a serious Bob Sapp pimp. He has no trouble at all making ends meat (so the story goes at least).
“4 year stint in the NHL”? Bob Sapp on ice skates… wow, that would be umm… hilarious.
Bah Justin…..what I clearly meant was “4 year stint in the NFL”, but I’m glad if anyone caught it, it was you. But yeah, that would be absolutely hilarious seeing Sapp on skates with huge equipment and a stick. Hilarious, but also terrifying.
*at work, can’t sign in
thats a good comparison eldiablo. that sounds about right. strikeforce would be good for lashley, and I doubt the ufc will give him a call until he shows really good ground skills, like fighting off of his back, improves his striking, and shows good submission defense. he is very raw, but he cannot rely on his strength to help him win. imo he needs to improve in all areas of martial arts to warrant a call-up to the UFC. for a guy his size he should be able to ko a guy with one punch, and we have yet to see that from him. I also think that depending on how kimbo’s situation works out, that will have a major impact on the way the ufc handles lashley. people still look at lashley as a wwe/wwf guy and not a mixed martial artist. so if kimbo the street fighter is even marginally successful, then the ufc might take a gamble on lashley. I seriously doubt kimbo will do ok in TUF, but you never know.
Some people still look at Lesnar as a WWE/WWF guy and not a mixed martial artist, but he’s in the UFC. I disagree with those people, just like I disagree with those that feel that way about Lashley, but they’re there.
Ya the WWE bashing is getting stale. He11 atleast its a form of physical entertainment. Where the guys are putting their health and bodies on the line. Not that Im a big fan of the stuff but I respect them for what they do. Espeacially with people who say that their not real fighters cause they’ve never trained. Well in that case I guess Don Frye, and Dan Severn arent real fighters than either. Cause they both came from “fake wrestling” straight to MMA.
The problem with Lesnar is not that he is a former professional wrestler. The problem with Lesnar is what he represents, which is a triumph of style over substance, and about valuing the ability to earn money more than the ability to earn respect or postion within the sport.
In a way I feel bad for Lesnar. Suppose he gets submitted by Mir again. I know its very difficult to beat someone twice, especially with Lesnar’s physical tools, but for the sake of discussion we’ll say its possible, keeping in mind Mir’s ground skills and Lesnar’s inexperience. After Lesnar loses, he’ll have to face someone else, most likely someone closer to his own size. This someone will probably have a broader skill-set than Lesnar, which isn’t all that hard because all we’ve seen from the guy is his “caveman’ing” his way to wins. Suppose Lesnar loses again, maybe by UD. It sort of leaves the guy not knowing where to go from there, hurts his confidence, and makes his championship run almost laughable. It diminishes the HW division and the sport. Maybe it’s wrong that I blame Lesnar, but defending him is almost inexplicable to me. I can understand his pro wrestling fans and those 12 year old kids wearing Deathclutch tshirts cheering him on, but an MMA enthusiast should recognize the Lesnar situation for what it is, although Dana White is far, far more responsible for this thing.
Think of it this way. Lesnar using his size to hold the HW championship is as bad as when Tim Sylvia did it, and we all saw how Sylvia turned out. I honestly hope circumstances are kinder to Lesnar when it all catches up to him then they have been to Sylvia, who is a bloated shadow of his former self.
If Lesnar retains against Mir [God forbid], I imagine we’ll see a lot of HW’s bulking up either naturally or pharmaceutically to try and have a fighting chance against him, or doing their damnedest to squeeze into the LHW ranks to avoid getting steamrolled by an opponent 40-50 pounds heavier than them come fighttime.
Not a pleasant outlook for the UFC HW division IMO.
Martial arts, and by extension mixed martial arts, are all about achievement through hard work and respectfully EARNING what you get. Any white belt learns this in the first few weeks of training. A world champion with 4 professional fights is like a joke with a bad punchline, PARTICULARLY in a combat sport where respect is a huge component of training from day one.
Having a promoter hand you an unearned title shot against an opponent 45 pounds lighter and 14 years older than you does not and should not endear you to MMA enthusiasts. Having a promoter hand you an unearned title shot after defeating a journeyman like Heath Herring is like getting a full week’s pay when you’ve only gone in for 2 or 3 days. Having a promoter hand you an unearned title shot because you can sell t-shirts and bump up PPV buy rates is like hiring someone for their looks instead of their skills.
I’ve been asked to and have agreed to stop expressing myself on the merits of the Lesnar situation, but I just wanted to clearly state what my problems are with the situation. The fact that the man is a former pro wrestler is not an issue. As someone pointed out Dan Severn wrestled professionally, as did I believe Ken Shamrock. A lot of MMA fighters have had all sorts of colorful jobs in the past.
Personally I could care less what a man does to earn an honest living, but it turns my stomach when someone receives undeserved rewards for such obvious reasons that are counter-intuitive to the sport. Unfortunately Dana White has put Brock Lesnar in the inenviable position of his in-cage success being detrimental to the HW division and the sport, which is all kinds of wrong to do to the man.
This is also the last time I’ll explain myself on the Lesnar issue, and thank you for providing the opportunity and intelligent platform in which to do so. This is by far the most MMA savvy forum I’ve ever visited…
Have to agree Justin, it is harder for them to shake that stigma. than anyone that comes into MMA. With all the steroid issues that have come out w/ american professional wrestling it is easy to see why. I can actually say though since I saw Lesnar win his NCAA championship over Wes Hand that he was bigger then than he is now.
Jcohl- You are vastly underestimating Lesnar’s dedication to the sport. As far as his pedigree he was 106-5 as an amateur wrestler at Minnesota and Bismark State CC. He couldn’t make the olympic team in ‘00 with Kerry McCoy(who moved up after they got rid of the 220lbs weight class, ironically Kurt Angle and Randy Couture’s class) and Rulon Gardner firmly entrenched at Heavyweight in freestyle and greco-roman respectively(that said neither could the starting guard for the New England Patriots and he was a World Champion). The guy has trained in MMA a lot longer than people realize and once he realized this was something he could do well he fully committed to it. I’ve been involved with MMA and amateur wrestling for years and I have no problem with it considering that amateur wrestling didn’t have a single person who became a millionaire off wrestling until John W. Smith did it off endorsements and his Ok State coaching salary.
As far as Lesnar “cave manning” around as you said how’s that any different than Guida, or Hughes early fights or even Randy’s early fights or Josh Barnett(the original Lesnar IMO)? Look at the other fighters in his camp… Sean Sherk, Nick Thompson, and Brock Larson. All have have big wrestling back grounds and with the exception of Thompson they fight largely the same.
I understand why you are mad about the promotional stuff with him. It’s the same reason so many people have a distaste for Kimbo. So feel free to feel that way about him but the guy does have the natural ability. Plus if he does lose to Mir by submission then where’s the shame in that? As far as where he goes he takes it like another loss and moves on an strings together wins and works back up to another title shot like anyone.
Using your weight and size to your advantage is part of any weight regulated sport and if Lesnar weighs in at 265 on weigh in day then there isn’t an issue because there is no violation of the rule because every fighter packs on pounds after weigh-ins(Din Thomas got sick after doing it). I know I’d weigh in for matches in HS at 215lbs in the am and then be 230 by match time that night. Did the same in college where the limit is 285. He’s wrestled for years so he knows how to cut weight. As long as guys like Lashley and Lesnar truly devote themselves to the sport they’re far from a detriment to the HW division in anyway shape or form and actually add visibility and marketing power to whatever organization they’re in.
Fantastic stuff Chrisl alot of great pints there.
Jcohl there is nothing i can realy say in response to your post that hasnt been mentioned before coutless times, but there is one thing I feel needs to be pointed out. Although its debatable and youl think im crazy but Lasnars shot at the title wasnt all that undeserving. Remember at the time this was a much slimmed down HW div. The only other man who was deserving of a title shot at the time was Werdum. Your comment about Herring isnt very solid either considering he had just beat one of the rising stars of the division in Kongo. And before that took Big Nog to a tough three round decision(plus almost KOed him). And didnt Nog get a shot at the Interim belt after beating Herring? So by beating him and giving former champ mir all he could handle the shot wasnt all that unwarrented. I must say that although I dissagree with your post at least you do your best to validate it and dont just come on here rambling and fighter bashing like people have in the past. And I thank you for calling me(I hope) and the rest of us savvy.
jcohl,
Even though I do disagree with you, definitely have to recognize that you argue the point intelligently. Chris and Carls have already said pretty much anything else I would have said on the topic, and then some.
didn’t read a sentence of any comments above I’m crazy like that kid
Ultimate Chaos was um ya, the commentating was on Affliction’s nutz but there were some interesting moments…
Who allows Chris to choke them out, it was clear that Chris didn’t want to “take any damage” before his fight on Affliction III: the last stand and this was clearly a warm up bout for the kid and I guess now he is a ground fighter??????????
Yvel destroyed Rizzo, and that ref is the one of the worst I’ve ever seen seriously and for the Shhhhhh everyone including myself have given Yvel over the years he for once acted like a professional after the fight, the ref should be suspended or somehting
Atencio paid that kid off forsure, no seriously for a moment Tom fought a hell of a fight, I don’t really think he is tops but he did well and good on him… He did look good and was rather knowledgable of sub defenses and the like but he needs to work on the actual usage of his knowledge.. good for him
Did Sapp say after getting his asss whooped “he hit me in da face and eye, and hurt me”… or some shhhh like that? Um hey Sapp that’s what he is suppose to do IT’s a FIGHT, Lashley well did what he did, he also needs to work on stuff but hey 4~0 is a good start, he isn’t ready for “the big time” but he is a strong guy with alot of wrestling talent behind him,,,, Lesnar is better than Lashley… I wouldn’t mind seeing Lashley v Lavar Johnson in StrikeForce… that would be awesome…
the show was ok and not Much else to say I believe
Great call on Lavar Johnson that’d be a fun fight to see.
thx I would really like to see that fight…. I think with Roger Gracie and well the few HW’s that StrikeForce does have the could easily have a little “tourney” for the opportunity to fight Alistair or whomever the champ should be..
Lavar
Bobby
Roger
Abongo
Werdum
loser of Brett v Alistair?
just thoughts out loud
I didnt know they had Werdum man. I checked their roster a while back a didnt see him.
Sorry about that Werdum is rumored to be signing with StrikeForce certainly not official and Bobby is more of “what I think shout happen” type of thing apologies
Ya i just checked and he wasnt their. get me all excited will you.
carls-yes, I definitely include you in my “savvy” comment.
And after reading all of your well-written points of view, I’ll try keeping a more open mind on the Lesnar thing.
Thanks again to everyone who responded, regardless of whether or not we see eye to eye, I respect all of your feedback…
you’re too nice F those guys that disagree with you…. who are they to try and tell you what is what, don’t conform to the system F that not everyone has to agree all the time, and I don’t give a damnn who are they trying to tell you what to think be an individual…
I’m Jack’s innner sarcasm
Im also the president of Jelly Beans…..
first rule of MMAfrenzy…
Ya I dont come on here just to agree with people. I love this sight cause everyone has thier own insight and fantastic opinions on MMA in all of its aspects. But at the same time appreciate the amount of professionalism.
I guess it was Jacks inner sarcasm who picked out that avatar.
ok guys i’m sorry, i’m sorry alright
Which name you goin with now dude? This one does seem a little more agressive.